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PostPosted: Sun 18 Mar 2012 9:11 pm 
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Redwolf wrote:
An Cionnfhaolach wrote:

Thirdly, when you are speaking Irish it seems as though you are being judged by everyone around you, to see how good you are , like a test. People are just waiting for you to make a mistake. This makes people very uncomfortable with speaking the language and could be the main reason why people are so hostile towards it. What people don't realise is making mistakes in language is an everyday occurance that is how language develops. Mistake are the drivers behind theses developments.


This is a particularly good point, and it's a problem that plagues learners as well.

Redwolf


It's hard to know what to do!! I wear the fáinne óir and I have to say that if I have Irish spoken to me once a year because of it, that is about it. I have never made little of any Gaeilge spoken to me and I am happy on the very few occasions somebody speaks it to me. A few friends and myself do have a meet-up once a week in the local teach ósta for a pint and a chat as Gaeilge, and a listen to some fine Irish music players, and people are always welcome.

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Bí cinnte de go nglacfaidh triúr le gach aistriúchán a thabharfar.
Be sure to get three in agreement with a translation given.


Last edited by Braoin on Sun 18 Mar 2012 9:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun 18 Mar 2012 9:41 pm 
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Redwolf wrote:
Interesting article. I'm surprised they didn't also address the growing interest in Irish in urban centers in Ireland. I think that's where the real hope for keeping the language viable lies.

A thing that's helpful for the Gaeltacht regions, though, is that interest in the language among people in North America also translates to cultural tourism, including immersion courses in the Gaeltacht. I know that many of the people who go to Oideas Gael come back year after year (I would, if that rich uncle I don't have would just hurry up and die!) When you have people coming in, spending money for food, lodging, etc., and WANTING TO SPEAK IRISH, it can be a very good thing.

Redwolf


I was just with a beginners class last weekend there was 9 in our class but easy 100 people in all the other classes in clondakin irish center this is in the heart of dublin when i went to the shop for a bottle of water i got greeted with a dia duit :)

Irish is coming on in leaps and bounds in the urban centres the blás baile athá cliath is coming back :P

I do have to say there was 2 Americans in my beginner Irish class as well .


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PostPosted: Sun 18 Mar 2012 9:50 pm 
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cytex wrote:
clondakin

My best friend from school moved to Clondalkin. Then I lost touch with her. :(
I don't know where to find her now.

Braoin wrote:
I have come to the point where soon I will not be wearing it.

Don't do that. You might miss a good conversation in Irish the day you take it off.

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___________________________________________________________

It is recommended that you always wait for three to agree on a translation.
I speak Connemara Irish, and my input will often reflect that.
I will do an mp3 file on request for short translations.

___________________________________________________________


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PostPosted: Sun 18 Mar 2012 9:57 pm 
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cytex wrote:
I was just with a beginners class last weekend there was 9 in our class but easy 100 people in all the other classes in clondakin irish center this is in the heart of dublin when i went to the shop for a bottle of water i got greeted with a dia duit :)

Irish is coming on in leaps and bounds in the urban centres the blás baile athá cliath is coming back :P

I do have to say there was 2 Americans in my beginner Irish class as well .


Thats great! Hopefully classes and interest like that will keep on flurishing

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Is Fearr súil romhainn ná ḋá ṡúil inár ndiaiḋ
(Amhlaoibh Ó Súilleabháin)

Please wait for corrections/ more input from other forum members before acting on advice


I'm familiar with Munster Irish/ Gaolainn na Mumhan (GM) and the Official Standard/an Caighdeán Oifigiúil (CO)


Last edited by Breandán on Mon 19 Mar 2012 12:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
Edited to fix quote.


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PostPosted: Mon 19 Mar 2012 11:26 am 
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Location: Hamilton, NJ, USA
Redwolf wrote:
An Cionnfhaolach wrote:

Thirdly, when you are speaking Irish it seems as though you are being judged by everyone around you, to see how good you are , like a test. People are just waiting for you to make a mistake. This makes people very uncomfortable with speaking the language and could be the main reason why people are so hostile towards it. What people don't realise is making mistakes in language is an everyday occurance that is how language develops. Mistake are the drivers behind theses developments.


This is a particularly good point, and it's a problem that plagues learners as well.

Redwolf


Yes, this can be very discouraging to some. But if corrections are pointed out tactfully rather than condescendingly (assuming the one doing the correcting is knowledgable, and offers an explanation, of course), the mistakes increase the learning opportunities exponentially. Every mistake I make is an opportunity for a "mini-lesson," and frequently, it is a lesson on things you won't find in books. So let people jump all over my mistakes. I view this as a stepping stone rather than a stumbling block.

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Táim ag foghlaim Gaelainn na Mumhan

Tá fáilte roim nach aon cheartú!
I am a learner. Any translations offered are practice and should not be used unless confirmed.


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PostPosted: Mon 19 Mar 2012 11:35 am 
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Aislingeach wrote:
Yes, this can be very discouraging to some. But if corrections are pointed out tactfully rather than condescendingly (assuming the one doing the correcting is knowledgable, and offers an explanation, of course), the mistakes increase the learning opportunities exponentially. Every mistake I make is an opportunity for a "mini-lesson," and frequently, it is a lesson on things you won't find in books. So let people jump all over my mistakes. I view this as a stepping stone rather than a stumbling block.


Mise freisin. :yes:
I am very happy to have knowledgeable people help me to improve. I personally create many, many, many opportunities for what Aislingeach refers to as "mini-lessons"!! 8-)

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Is foghlaimeoir mé. I am a learner. DEFINITELY wait for others to confirm and/or improve.
Beatha teanga í a labhairt.


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PostPosted: Mon 19 Mar 2012 2:55 pm 
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The way we used to handle it at IGTF was not to offer corrections in posts tagged "GA" ("GA" actually originally stood for "Gan Aistriúchán," though people came to interpret it as "Gaeilge Amháin." The effect was the same, though...they were conversational or informational posts made in Irish.). The idea was that such posts gave people a place to practice without worrying too much about making mistakes (an essential step in the process toward becoming fluent).

If a person made a post entirely in Irish and it wasn't tagged "GA" we might ask if he or she wanted corrections...especially if the poster didn't seem to be clearly looking for something else.

Corrections are good up to a point. They are part of the learning process. But for fluency to be achieved, there also needs to be a "safe place" where one's every grammatical error or odd word choice isn't jumped on, so long as one's meaning is understood. Otherwise the learner will never get to the point where he or she is comfortable conversing. In such situations, I would only point out an error if it was one that was likely to cause the speaker real embarrassment or confusion down the road (and not one that he or she was likely to catch and correct on his or her own).

Redwolf


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PostPosted: Thu 22 Mar 2012 3:16 pm 
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The only way for me to learn is to make mistakes, and for that reason, I have no shame. I think it's easier being an American learner of Irish because most people here know nothing about the language. Some people don't even know it exists. The most popular reactions I get are, "Why would you want to do learn that?" and then they shrug it off, or, "Oh, that's cool." And then they shrug it off, too.

But that's also the downside, because I have no one in my life to speak it with on a daily basis. Except for my children, but they are also still learning English. :darklaugh:

But get this! My 18-month-old just started calling his grandma Mamó, all on his own! He must have it in his blood. Either that, or it's a natural progression from "Mama", which is what he calls me, and he's been calling his grandma "Mama" for a while and she's been correcting him ("No, I'm GRAM MAW!"). But instead of picking up "Grandma", he started saying Mamó. :D

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I'm very much a beginner learner. Don't hesitate to correct me, as long as you explain why. This is how I learn best!


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PostPosted: Thu 22 Mar 2012 3:29 pm 
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Quote:
The only way for me to learn is to make mistakes, and for that reason, I have no shame. I think it's easier being an American learner of Irish because most people here know nothing about the language.


many Irish people don't know much about the language either :), at least most wouldn't be able to see if you make mistakes or not, since they only remember of Dia duit, sláinte and fáilte :darklaugh:

Quote:
Some people don't even know it exists. The most popular reactions I get are, "Why would you want to do learn that?"


I'd answer "because it's the most beautiful language on earth" :)

Quote:
But that's also the downside, because I have no one in my life to speak it with on a daily basis. Except for my children, but they are also still learning English. :darklaugh:


can't you use skype? I think several members of this forum use it to chat in Irish

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Is fearr Gaeilg na Gaeltaċta ná Gaeilg ar biṫ eile
Agus is í Gaeilg Ġaoṫ Doḃair is binne
:)


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PostPosted: Thu 22 Mar 2012 3:56 pm 
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Lughaidh wrote:
I'd answer "because it's the most beautiful language on earth" :)

Nice. Will use. :)

Lughaidh wrote:
can't you use skype? I think several members of this forum use it to chat in Irish


I can, and someday I will, but not yet. I need a few years under my belt before I do that. All I'd be able to do right now is recite nouns. :cry:

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I'm very much a beginner learner. Don't hesitate to correct me, as long as you explain why. This is how I learn best!


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