Hi,

I've been reviewing lessons and have come across a couple of phrases where I need some clarification on why a particular spelling/form is used. I'd appreciate any help.

In the phrases below:
Tá leabhair aige.
Tá an fear ag tiomáint gluaisteáin.

Is it a correct assumption that "leabhair" is plural but "gluaisteáin" is genitive? Or would it be an objective form (i.e. the object of the verb)?

I'm using Rosetta and, it doesn't clarify as there are no explanations aside from what can be intuited from the images so, it's difficult to figure out at times.

Thanks,
Kelly

I'm not generally familiar with the grammatical terminology, but you are correct.

In the first sentence "leabhair" is in the plural. In the second "gluaisteáin" is in the genitive singular.

Dear Kelly,

I think you will find Rosetta Stone is a great way to learn Irish as long as you supplement it with grammar references. The pronunciations are excellent and for Irish taking a speaking- and listening-heavy approach is very important.

Here is a link to a grammar reference online (one of many useful resources)
http://nualeargais.ie/gnag/gram.htm



So as Gumbi explained, you are correct that "leabhair" is plural and "gluaisteáin" is genitive and not an object. That is because this second sentence is literally "the man is at the driving of a car" or "the man is at a car's driving"
Later on Rosetta Stone will show you how to form these sentences without using the genitive. In the beginning it uses these because they appear simpler (even though they are more complicated because the genitive case is certainly more complicated than séimhiú and urú).
If you are curious it will be "Tá gluaisteán á thiomáint ag an bhfear"

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ЯГОН ТОҶИК НЕСТ ИНҶО???

Which literaly translates to ‘a car is at its driving by the man’, and I wouldn’t really call it simpler, even though it does not use genitive. It is a bit more complicated syntax, and introduces merging of prepositions with possessive pronouns. I believe that is the reason to show the genitive sentences first (they also show why possessives are needed when you start using pronouns), not any difficulty with mutations. ;-)

There's no special object form (= accusative) in Irish.

Plural and genitive singular have often the same form: leabhair, gluaisteáin. (as well as in English, btw.: book(’)s, car(’)s )
So you must parse the sentence to find out what’s what.
Translating literally is always helpful to understand and "feel" the structure.
Following a verbal noun it’s usually genitive: Tá an fear ag tiomáint gluaisteáin. - "Is the man at driving of a car."

that literally blew my mind


Perhaps so, indeed. To me they seemed easier, but perhaps it was because I had already been prepared for it. I am impressed that Rosetta Stone put such thought into it, given that it seems much of their software is reused across languages. I can't say enough how impressed I was with their product, although the cost is really quite too much.

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ЯГОН ТОҶИК НЕСТ ИНҶО???

Thanks all for the very detailed and clear explanations! That helped quite a bit.

I am a fan of literal translations too as it helps me remember the native sentence structure better (rather than trying to force Irish into an English sentence structure/form).

Again, all the info and advice is much appreciated.

Kelly