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 Post subject: anuas v. suas
PostPosted: Mon 17 Oct 2016 8:11 pm 
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This is one of those timeless questions that everyone always has. I apologize.

I read:
"[...] duine a bheadh i bhfad ní b'airde [...] agus a bheadh ag breathnú anuas ort."

I thought, why "breathnú anuas" and not "breathnú suas"?

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 Post subject: Re: anuas v. suas
PostPosted: Mon 17 Oct 2016 8:48 pm 
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Cúmhaí wrote:
This is one of those timeless questions that everyone always has. I apologize.

I read:
"[...] duine a bheadh i bhfad ní b'airde [...] agus a bheadh ag breathnú anuas ort."

I thought, why "breathnú anuas" and not "breathnú suas"?


He'd be looking down on you.

anuas, síos = down
suas, aníos = up

It is a matter of perspective.

Let's imagine
Romeo & Juliet, Act 3, Scene 5 "It was the nightingale ...":

anuas = downward (from a higher position of someone), eg. Juliet speaks from her balkony "anuas" to Romeo
suas = upward (from a lower position and perspective), e.g. Romeo under the balcony speaks "suas" to Juliet
síos = downward (in the direction of someone down), e.g. Romeo is spoken to "síos" by Juliet.
aníos = upward (in the direction of someone up), e.g. Juliet is spoken to "aníos" by Romeo.

Image


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 Post subject: Re: anuas v. suas
PostPosted: Tue 18 Oct 2016 7:14 am 
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If you can get hold of the 'New Irish Grammar - by the Christian Brothers' - it's set out there in diagram form on page 140 and there are further explanations on the following page. It's the same for North, South, East and West (U - E - O - I). I have the 1999 reprint edition. I'm sorry if this book brings back painful memories to anyone here.

I think I've quoted this before, but here it is again - taken from the book and CD Rabhlaí Rabhlaí

MO LIATHRÓIDÍN DONN

Anonn is anall leis,
Anonn is anall leis,
Anonn is anall leis,
Mo liathróidín donn.

Ó lámh go lámh leis,
Ó lámh go lámh leis,
Ó lámh go lámh leis,
Mo liathróidín donn.

Timpeall mo chinn leis,
Timpeall mo chinn leis,
Timpeall mo chinn leis,
Mo liathróidín donn.

Suas is anuas leis,
Suas is anuas leis,
Suas is anuas leis,
Mo liathróidín donn.

Síos is aníos leis,
Síos is aníos leis,
Síos is aníos leis,
Mo liathróidín donn.


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 Post subject: Re: anuas v. suas
PostPosted: Fri 21 Oct 2016 8:15 pm 
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Thank you, friends.

Come to think of it I have been sent by my Irish teacher that very reference... I just never actually opened the email. Perhaps now I shall, albeit too late

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 Post subject: Re: anuas v. suas
PostPosted: Sat 22 Oct 2016 6:23 am 
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A literal translation makes it even easier:
an- = from, s- = to; -uas = up, -íos = down

an-uas = from-up
s-uas = to-up
an-íos = from-down
s-íos = to-down


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 Post subject: Re: anuas v. suas
PostPosted: Tue 25 Oct 2016 3:31 am 
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Labhrás wrote:
A literal translation makes it even easier:
an- = from, s- = to; -uas = up, -íos = down

an-uas = from-up
s-uas = to-up
an-íos = from-down
s-íos = to-down


I think this is exactly how I put it to a friend today after she made a mistake saying some people were suas and she needed to go anuas to get them

Definitely the best approach

Thanks, a Labhráis

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 Post subject: Re: anuas v. suas
PostPosted: Tue 25 Oct 2016 6:39 pm 
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I have another question

Okay so we have

síos thíos aníos (N) (down)
suas thuas anuas (S) (up)
soir thoir anoir (E) (front)
siar thiar aniar (W) (back)

Where s- means "to the" th- means "in the" and an- means "from the"

So you could say "Anuas ón bhFrainc" or "Anuas ó na sléibhte"
Effectively in English "up [from the South] from France" and "down [from 'up'] from the mountains", right?

You can say "Dul síos an staighre" but can you also say "Dul anuas an staighre"??

Is it possible to say "Luí siar sa leaba" or "Luí anoir sa leaba"? It isn't, right??

and what is 'anonn' ? is there a sonn and thonn also?

perhaps I should get out a reference instead of just posting questions

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 Post subject: Re: anuas v. suas
PostPosted: Tue 25 Oct 2016 8:36 pm 
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Cúmhaí wrote:
I have another question

Okay so we have

síos thíos aníos (N) (down)
suas thuas anuas (S) (up)
soir thoir anoir (E) (front)
siar thiar aniar (W) (back)

Where s- means "to the" th- means "in the" and an- means "from the"

So you could say "Anuas ón bhFrainc" or "Anuas ó na sléibhte"
Effectively in English "up [from the South] from France" and "down [from 'up'] from the mountains", right?


There's a farraige between Ireland and France, so you'd rather come "anall ón ḃFrainc"

Quote:
You can say "Dul síos an staighre" but can you also say "Dul anuas an staighre"??

Is fearr "teacht anuas an staighre". ("Dul" needs rather a target than a starting point)

Quote:
Is it possible to say "Luí siar sa leaba" or "Luí anoir sa leaba"? It isn't, right??


Sounds odd.

Quote:
and what is 'anonn' ? is there a sonn and thonn also?


Sonn is in the dictionary but marked as "Lit"


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 Post subject: Re: anuas v. suas
PostPosted: Tue 25 Oct 2016 9:50 pm 
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Labhrás wrote:
Quote:
and what is 'anonn' ? is there a sonn and thonn also?


Sonn is in the dictionary but marked as "Lit"



so there is also
sall thall anall (this side)
sonn thonn anonn (that side)

Thus "Teacht anonn ón bhFrainc" and "Dul sall ón bhFrainc"
"Teacht anall go Meiriceá" and "Dul sonn go Meiriceá"?

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