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PostPosted: Fri 18 Oct 2024 11:06 pm 
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Posts: 11
Hi all, I come from Irish ancestry and am looking to get a couple of phrases tattooed, however I want to be sure that the translations are accurate.
the phrases are: "For those who are gone" and "For the survivors".
I have tried multiple translating search engines and most have translated these phrases as such: "Dóibh siúd atá imithe" and "Do na marthanóirí"
I don't have a lot of trust in the computer to translate these correctly, especially a language as complex as Gaelic.
Thank you for your help and taking the time to read!


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Oct 2024 6:29 am 
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Joined: Thu 22 Dec 2011 6:28 am
Posts: 459
Location: Corcaigh
danielmckeever wrote:
Hi all, I come from Irish ancestry and am looking to get a couple of phrases tattooed, however I want to be sure that the translations are accurate.
the phrases are: "For those who are gone" and "For the survivors".
I have tried multiple translating search engines and most have translated these phrases as such: "Dóibh siúd atá imithe" and "Do na marthanóirí"
I don't have a lot of trust in the computer to translate these correctly, especially a language as complex as Gaelic.
Thank you for your help and taking the time to read!


It's a bit of a schoolboy myth that Irish is particularly complex. Nevertheless, you're right not to trust machine translation for something like a tattoo.

Just to clarify, the subtext here is something like "[I have this tattoo] for those who are gone" and "[I have this tattoo] for the survivors", right?


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Oct 2024 8:49 am 
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Joined: Fri 08 Jul 2022 11:58 am
Posts: 9
I would probably use the preposition chun, but to get the rest as accurately as possible, you'd have to elaborate on why you're getting the tattoo in the first place. Currently, it seems cheesy and vague.


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Oct 2024 1:53 pm 
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Joined: Thu 02 Nov 2023 11:42 pm
Posts: 110
Location: Denver, Colorado
danielmckeever wrote:
Hi all, I come from Irish ancestry and am looking to get a couple of phrases tattooed, however I want to be sure that the translations are accurate.
the phrases are: "For those who are gone" and "For the survivors".
I have tried multiple translating search engines and most have translated these phrases as such: "Dóibh siúd atá imithe" and "Do na marthanóirí"
I don't have a lot of trust in the computer to translate these correctly, especially a language as complex as Gaelic.
Thank you for your help and taking the time to read!


I would use ar son (which literally translates to 'for the sake of') instead of do. You could also consider using caillte instead of imithe, which means 'lost' but is usually euphemistic for 'dead'. You might also want to consider using fuíoll instead of marthanóir, which is mostly used in a judicial context. This would then all be something like Ar son na muintire (atá) caillte, ar son na bhfuíoll.

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I'm an intermediate speaker of the Corca Dhuibhne dialect of Irish and also have knowledge on the old spelling
Soir gaċ síar, fé ḋeireaḋ thíar


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Oct 2024 11:21 pm 
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Joined: Fri 18 Oct 2024 10:51 pm
Posts: 11
Ade wrote:
danielmckeever wrote:
Hi all, I come from Irish ancestry and am looking to get a couple of phrases tattooed, however I want to be sure that the translations are accurate.
the phrases are: "For those who are gone" and "For the survivors".
I have tried multiple translating search engines and most have translated these phrases as such: "Dóibh siúd atá imithe" and "Do na marthanóirí"
I don't have a lot of trust in the computer to translate these correctly, especially a language as complex as Gaelic.
Thank you for your help and taking the time to read!


It's a bit of a schoolboy myth that Irish is particularly complex. Nevertheless, you're right not to trust machine translation for something like a tattoo.

Just to clarify, the subtext here is something like "[I have this tattoo] for those who are gone" and "[I have this tattoo] for the survivors", right?


Thank you for your reply, yes, I am referring to people who have passed away from addiction and for the people who have survived.


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Oct 2024 11:22 pm 
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Joined: Fri 18 Oct 2024 10:51 pm
Posts: 11
liamo5 wrote:
I would probably use the preposition chun, but to get the rest as accurately as possible, you'd have to elaborate on why you're getting the tattoo in the first place. Currently, it seems cheesy and vague.


Thanks for the reply, I am getting the tattoos in memorial to people who have passed away from addiction, and for people who have survived.


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Oct 2024 11:37 pm 
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Joined: Fri 18 Oct 2024 10:51 pm
Posts: 11
Séamus O'Neill wrote:
danielmckeever wrote:
Hi all, I come from Irish ancestry and am looking to get a couple of phrases tattooed, however I want to be sure that the translations are accurate.
the phrases are: "For those who are gone" and "For the survivors".
I have tried multiple translating search engines and most have translated these phrases as such: "Dóibh siúd atá imithe" and "Do na marthanóirí"
I don't have a lot of trust in the computer to translate these correctly, especially a language as complex as Gaelic.
Thank you for your help and taking the time to read!


I would use ar son (which literally translates to 'for the sake of') instead of do. You could also consider using caillte instead of imithe, which means 'lost' but is usually euphemistic for 'dead'. You might also want to consider using fuíoll instead of marthanóir, which is mostly used in a judicial context. This would then all be something like Ar son na muintire (atá) caillte, ar son na bhfuíoll.


Thank you for your reply, so if I understand correctly, your translation is roughly: "For the sake of those who are lost." "For the sake of those who remain (survived)". For context, I am memorializing people who have passed away from addiction, and people who have survived.


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Oct 2024 12:19 am 
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Joined: Thu 02 Nov 2023 11:42 pm
Posts: 110
Location: Denver, Colorado
danielmckeever wrote:
Séamus O'Neill wrote:
danielmckeever wrote:
Hi all, I come from Irish ancestry and am looking to get a couple of phrases tattooed, however I want to be sure that the translations are accurate.
the phrases are: "For those who are gone" and "For the survivors".
I have tried multiple translating search engines and most have translated these phrases as such: "Dóibh siúd atá imithe" and "Do na marthanóirí"
I don't have a lot of trust in the computer to translate these correctly, especially a language as complex as Gaelic.
Thank you for your help and taking the time to read!


I would use ar son (which literally translates to 'for the sake of') instead of do. You could also consider using caillte instead of imithe, which means 'lost' but is usually euphemistic for 'dead'. You might also want to consider using fuíoll instead of marthanóir, which is mostly used in a judicial context. This would then all be something like Ar son na muintire (atá) caillte, ar son na bhfuíoll.


Thank you for your reply, so if I understand correctly, your translation is roughly: "For the sake of those who are lost." "For the sake of those who remain (survived)". For context, I am memorializing people who have passed away from addiction, and people who have survived.


Very roughly, yes. However, in Irish, it is more common to use more complicated compound prepositions (such as ar son 'for the sake of', mar gheall 'concerning', i dtreo 'so that', as ucht 'on account of') instead of what would normally just in English translate to 'for'. Just in case you wanted to know, in the older/more traditional spelling and font, this would actually be Air son na muinntire (atá) caillte, air son na na ḃ(-)fuíoll.

_________________
I'm an intermediate speaker of the Corca Dhuibhne dialect of Irish and also have knowledge on the old spelling
Soir gaċ síar, fé ḋeireaḋ thíar


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PostPosted: Tue 22 Oct 2024 11:06 pm 
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Joined: Fri 18 Oct 2024 10:51 pm
Posts: 11
Séamus O'Neill wrote:
danielmckeever wrote:
Séamus O'Neill wrote:
danielmckeever wrote:
Hi all, I come from Irish ancestry and am looking to get a couple of phrases tattooed, however I want to be sure that the translations are accurate.
the phrases are: "For those who are gone" and "For the survivors".
I have tried multiple translating search engines and most have translated these phrases as such: "Dóibh siúd atá imithe" and "Do na marthanóirí"
I don't have a lot of trust in the computer to translate these correctly, especially a language as complex as Gaelic.
Thank you for your help and taking the time to read!


I would use ar son (which literally translates to 'for the sake of') instead of do. You could also consider using caillte instead of imithe, which means 'lost' but is usually euphemistic for 'dead'. You might also want to consider using fuíoll instead of marthanóir, which is mostly used in a judicial context. This would then all be something like Ar son na muintire (atá) caillte, ar son na bhfuíoll.


Thank you for your reply, so if I understand correctly, your translation is roughly: "For the sake of those who are lost." "For the sake of those who remain (survived)". For context, I am memorializing people who have passed away from addiction, and people who have survived.


Very roughly, yes. However, in Irish, it is more common to use more complicated compound prepositions (such as ar son 'for the sake of', mar gheall 'concerning', i dtreo 'so that', as ucht 'on account of') instead of what would normally just in English translate to 'for'. Just in case you wanted to know, in the older/more traditional spelling and font, this would actually be Air son na muinntire (atá) caillte, air son na na ḃ(-)fuíoll.


Thank you for your response, I guess my next question would be the use of parenthesis, () in the word, atá. Is the usage of that particular punctuation to specify who we are referring to, in this case, "who are"? Also with the traditional spelling, what does the, - in bhfuíoll, represent/function as? Thanks again.


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PostPosted: Wed 23 Oct 2024 12:17 am 
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Joined: Thu 02 Nov 2023 11:42 pm
Posts: 110
Location: Denver, Colorado
danielmckeever wrote:
Séamus O'Neill wrote:
danielmckeever wrote:
Séamus O'Neill wrote:
danielmckeever wrote:
Hi all, I come from Irish ancestry and am looking to get a couple of phrases tattooed, however I want to be sure that the translations are accurate.
the phrases are: "For those who are gone" and "For the survivors".
I have tried multiple translating search engines and most have translated these phrases as such: "Dóibh siúd atá imithe" and "Do na marthanóirí"
I don't have a lot of trust in the computer to translate these correctly, especially a language as complex as Gaelic.
Thank you for your help and taking the time to read!


I would use ar son (which literally translates to 'for the sake of') instead of do. You could also consider using caillte instead of imithe, which means 'lost' but is usually euphemistic for 'dead'. You might also want to consider using fuíoll instead of marthanóir, which is mostly used in a judicial context. This would then all be something like Ar son na muintire (atá) caillte, ar son na bhfuíoll.


Thank you for your reply, so if I understand correctly, your translation is roughly: "For the sake of those who are lost." "For the sake of those who remain (survived)". For context, I am memorializing people who have passed away from addiction, and people who have survived.


Very roughly, yes. However, in Irish, it is more common to use more complicated compound prepositions (such as ar son 'for the sake of', mar gheall 'concerning', i dtreo 'so that', as ucht 'on account of') instead of what would normally just in English translate to 'for'. Just in case you wanted to know, in the older/more traditional spelling and font, this would actually be Air son na muinntire (atá) caillte, air son na na ḃ(-)fuíoll.


Thank you for your response, I guess my next question would be the use of parenthesis, () in the word, atá. Is the usage of that particular punctuation to specify who we are referring to, in this case, "who are"? Also with the traditional spelling, what does the, - in bhfuíoll, represent/function as? Thanks again.
I put atá in parenthesis there because it is essentially optional. caillte is the verbal adjective (which in English is more often referred to as the past participle), and thus functions as an adjective itself. So it would essentially in English be the difference between saying 'for those who are gone' and 'for the gone/left ones' (which in English sounds kind of strange, and is why we are more prone to producing the former construction).

The (-) in the word ḃ(-)fuíoll basically just represents that you could write ḃ-fuíoll or ḃfuíoll, albeit the latter being more common

_________________
I'm an intermediate speaker of the Corca Dhuibhne dialect of Irish and also have knowledge on the old spelling
Soir gaċ síar, fé ḋeireaḋ thíar


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