Hello yall! The suffix -idh and -fidh confuses me.

I have seen it said that the suffix -idh can be pronounced \ee\

I have also seen it said that dh is \y\ when slender and \g\ when broad, thus -idh should make a \y\ sound.

However, I have then seen, for example cruinneóidh where this is pronounced \krin-gy-ohg\. I have written in my notes that -idh is a "palatized g", whatever that means lol.

On the reading of future tense irregular verbs here: http://www.nualeargais.ie/foghlaim/irre ... hp?teanga=

the -idh is always \ee\ and -fidh seems to be \hee\. I like this consistency. However, the f making an \h\ sound is strange, I don't think i've seen that mentioned anywhere else.

I realize Irish has different dialects, and perhaps all these options are okay under certain circumstances, but I just wanted to post this here to see if I could get some insights from anybody.

Any feedback helps! I appreciate y'all so much!

You have to learn properly by going systematically through a book.

-idh is usually a palatalised g, but is often just nothing. Glanfaidh - will clean - is glanhig, but glanfaidh sé - he will clean - is glanhi shay. The g is omitted before pronouns.

It is not the correct approach to dip into every tense that you have not learnt. You need to learn properly.

Alright fine, I'll do it lol. But under one condition: You send me a pdf of the grammar book you would recommend most.

Connacht and Ulster:

-idh: Often pronounced \ee.
-fidh: Often pronounced \hee.
Munster:

-idh: Can be pronounced with a palatalized \g\ sound, resulting in \y\ or \gy\ sounds.
-fidh: The f can be pronounced as \h, leading to \hee.
These variations are due to the rich diversity of Irish dialects, and it's normal to encounter different pronunciations. It's important to consider the context and the specific dialect when learning Irish.

I don't think it's true to say this is the case for all of Connacht, but it's probably the case in Mayo - especially getting more northerly.
In coastal Galway I think the idh/igh is a schwa sound, this is the grunty sound we make in English, like the 'a' sound in "I'm gonna" when you say that phrase quickly.
Irish actually has two grunty sounds, one for broad and slender. The slender sound is still grunty but closer to an 'i' sound, this is why djwebb wrote 'glanfaidh sé' phonetically as 'glanhi shay', whereas you'd often hear 'glanfaidh tú' phonetically as 'glanhuh tuh'.

There's a great reference for your question in this section on braesicke.de. It's in German, but if you're using Google Chrome (and probably other browsers) you can translate it directly from the browser. As grammar guides on Irish go, this website is the most complete and is an excellent reference.


Letter combinations make different sounds depending on whether they're at the start, middle or end of the word, and they also can vary by region.
Initial slender 'dh' is \y\ but initial broad 'dh' is not \g\, it's a much throatier sound.


It's similar to an English g, except you pronounce it further forward in your mouth. Similarly a broad g is pronounced further back in your throat.
Whatever book you're reading will probably explain broad (velarised)/slender (palatised) as a spelling rule, but these sounds are produced differently to the English sounds.

While it is true that the slender k and g are further forward than the English sounds, nevertheless the English k, g and ng are more palatalised than velarised. The k and ng in "king" are both slender in most English speakers' pronunciations: /kʲʰɪŋʲ/ (palatalisation is not phonemic in English, so the word wouldn't mean anything different if not pronounced like this, but all consonants in English have to be somewhere on the patalal/velar continuum).

The problem is the broad gutturals. E.g. cuin, "dogs" (=cúnna in the CO) should have a broad k, but is hard to pronounce for English speakers. I suspect most learners say cin , which is a different word.

Gaelainn - should have a broad g. I suspect most learners say Géalainn, with a slender g.

At least for Irish school children (and most teachers), you hear Gaeilge pronounced as gwaylguh with English phonetics, so as to your point - yes, the g would be rendered slightly slender as per English phonetics.
Furthermore, I think most learners recognise the glide sound and reproduce it exclusively as an English w instead of a velar offglide.
Similarly most learners differentiate bó and beo only by inserting an English w after the b, even though the b is formed differently and the ó is more retracted in bó.


For 'cuin' I'm very confident they'd pronounce it as kwin with an English c and w sound.

OK, that's not right either, of course.

Does anyone has anything else to say to help the OP here? An bhfuil aon duine eile anso gur mhaith leis cuidiu leis an mbunphostálaí sa tsnáithe seo?