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 Post subject: air aici
PostPosted: Fri 02 Feb 2024 11:52 am 
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Phrases with more than one prepositional pronouns are quite hard for me to understand, as they're hard to look up in dictionaries:
Quote:
D’óbair di a grá do Vinicius d’admháil ar an láthair sin agus níor thaise do san é. Ach do smachtaigh sí a croí i gcionn neómait, agus do bhí sé air aici. Leis sin d’éirigh sí agus do theith sí uaidh.

This is from Andrias Ó Céileachair's Quo Vadis?
Do bhí sé air aici - does this mean "she had composed herself?


EDIT: Dinneen p55 has "bheadh sé air aige é dhéanamh" - 'twould take him all his time to do it.
It literally means "she had it on it", but I'm now thinking it means "she had great difficulty in doing so".


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 Post subject: Re: air aici
PostPosted: Sat 03 Feb 2024 11:57 am 
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This is a translation from (probably) an English version of Sienkiewicz’s novel.
What is the original?

I could not find it in my copies (German, English) because it is too short (or too much altered).


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 Post subject: Re: air aici
PostPosted: Sat 03 Feb 2024 1:37 pm 
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Well, many translations into Irish are not exact translations as some English-style flowery phrases would seem ridiculous to put into Irish exactly (a point made by Ua Laoghaire and O'Nolan). The English (Ch27) has:
Quote:
And that moment breath failed in her breast, presence of mind left her, a certain quiver of ecstasy rushed over her from head to feet. Seizing his temples with her hands, she tried to raise him, but bent the while so that her lips touched his hair; and for a moment both were overcome with delight, with themselves, and with love, which urged them the one to the other.
Lygia rose at last and rushed away, with a flame in her veins and a giddiness in her head; but that was the drop which overflowed the cup filled already to the brim. Vinicius did not divine how dearly he would have to pay for that happy moment, but Lygia understood that now she herself needed rescue.

The Irish has:
Quote:
Do baineadh a hanál di, do chaill sí a meabhair nách mór, agus do bhí sí ag crith le haiteas ó bhonn go baitheas. Do thóg sí a cheann idir a dá láimh agus do dhein sí iarracht ar é d’árdú agus nuair do chrom sí a ceann leis an iarracht san, do thárla gur theangmhaigh a beóla lena ghruaig. D’óbair di a grá do Vinicius d’admháil ar an láthair sin agus níor thaise do san é. Ach do smachtaigh sí a croí i gcionn neómait, agus do bhí sé air aici. Leis sin d’éirigh sí agus do theith sí uaidh.
Do thuig Vinicius go maith an díol-fiach nárbh fholáir do a dhéanamh thar cheann an méid sin aoibhnis. Ba léir do Ligia anois go gcaithfeadh sí cabhair d’fháil.


As you can see, there is no direct English equivalent for the "air aici" phrase.


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 Post subject: Re: air aici
PostPosted: Sat 03 Feb 2024 1:51 pm 
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As you can see, the English has "Vinicius did not divine how dearly..." and the Irish has "do thuig Vinicius go maith", the total opposite.... The Polish original is at https://polona.pl/item-view/e6895ad9-05 ... 96?page=65 Of course, the English translation is correct, as the Polish is: Viniciusz nie domyślił się (did not realise).


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 Post subject: Re: air aici
PostPosted: Tue 06 Feb 2024 8:39 pm 
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Hmm, still don’t have a clue.

Bhí sé air aici.

Who’s "sé"? Her heart? Marcus V. himself?
So, lit.: She had it on him. / She had him on it.
or: He had it at her?

Isn’t usually ag before ar?
e.g. Tá meas aici air, tá deich bpunt aici air ...
Why not here?


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 Post subject: Re: air aici
PostPosted: Tue 06 Feb 2024 9:32 pm 
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Well sé here means "it" not "he". If you look at Dinneen's dictionary: "bheadh sé air aige é dhéanamh" - 'twould take him all his time to do it. Literally "it would be on it with him to do it". But not easy or intuitive for a non-native speaker.

Maybe it's kind of linked to: do thit an lug ar an lag aici, "she collapsed in dismay". Ua Laoghaire explained this idiom as meaning “the small fell upon the weak with her”, in other words, smallness found no other support than weakness in her, and so she collapsed. But in "do bhí sé air aici", lug and lag are both replaced by "it".


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 Post subject: Re: air aici
PostPosted: Tue 06 Feb 2024 10:06 pm 
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In FGB check "air", 3rd meaning. :)


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 Post subject: Re: air aici
PostPosted: Tue 06 Feb 2024 10:41 pm 
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Errigal wrote:
In FGB check "air", 3rd meaning. :)


I'm wondering if the interpretation "do bhí sé ar eire aige é ' dhéanamh" is just Ó Dónall's theory? Dinneen didn't realise this, at any rate? But if this is generally thought to be the etymology, it's good to know.


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