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PostPosted: Mon 26 Jun 2017 10:12 am 
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Hi, folks,

I'm writing on a song and just wanted to incorporate the Irish language in it. I'm currently learning to write and speak it but I'm not that far yet so I need your help with translating this passage:

"From the darkness of the earth we are born.
And to the darkness of the earth we will return.
It's a journy everyone will take.
It's a journy everyone fears.
It's a journy everyone has to take.
And once it's over our bodies will leave our souls and become earth again to be the template for a new beginning."

I used some ideas from the Celtic beliefe that everybody is made from earth and that the soul does not live inside the body but vice versa.

If someone could please help me translate this that woul be fantastic.

Thanks in advance.


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PostPosted: Fri 07 Jul 2017 11:32 pm 
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Birkl wrote:
Hi, folks,

I'm writing on a song and just wanted to incorporate the Irish language in it. I'm currently learning to write and speak it but I'm not that far yet so I need your help with translating this passage:

"From the darkness of the earth we are born.
And to the darkness of the earth we will return.
It's a journy everyone will take.
It's a journy everyone fears.
It's a journy everyone has to take.
And once it's over our bodies will leave our souls and become earth again to be the template for a new beginning."

I used some ideas from the Celtic beliefe that everybody is made from earth and that the soul does not live inside the body but vice versa.

If someone could please help me translate this that woul be fantastic.

Thanks in advance.


It's a good idea to be very cautious about so-called Celtic beliefs that you read about online or in new wave books, because most of what has been written is nonsense. For historical reasons, very little is truly known about the religious beliefs of people in pre-Christian Ireland (or Scotland or Wales), and people have been making it up for over 1,500 years. Recent scholarship shows that even the monks who wrote down many myths and legends in the early Christian period and then in the Middle Ages altered them for religious reasons, or made some of them up out of whole cloth.

As to the translation you asked for, here's a start, but be sure to wait for comments by others, because things can be said various ways, there are multiple choices for some terms, and someone else may be able to do something more poetic:

Ón dorchadas an domhain a bheirtear muid
From the darkness of the earth we are born

'S go dtí dorchadas an domhain a fillfimid
And to the darkness of the earth we will return

Sé turas a rachaidh gach aon duine air
It's a journey everyone will take

Sé turas atá eagla ar gach aon duine roimh
It's a journey everyone fears.

Sé turas is éigean do gach aon duine á dhéanamh
It's a journey everyone has to take.

Agus nuair atá sé críochnaithe
And once it's over

fágfaidh ár gcoirp ár n-anamacha
our bodies will leave our souls

agus éireoidh siad i dtalamh arís
and they will become earth again

chun a bheith bonn an túis núa
to be the basis for a new beginning
[I don't know of a word to use for template in this sense]

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PostPosted: Sat 08 Jul 2017 5:43 pm 
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Location: Santa Cruz Mountains, California, USA
CaoimhínSF wrote:
Birkl wrote:
Hi, folks,

I'm writing on a song and just wanted to incorporate the Irish language in it. I'm currently learning to write and speak it but I'm not that far yet so I need your help with translating this passage:

"From the darkness of the earth we are born.
And to the darkness of the earth we will return.
It's a journy everyone will take.
It's a journy everyone fears.
It's a journy everyone has to take.
And once it's over our bodies will leave our souls and become earth again to be the template for a new beginning."

I used some ideas from the Celtic beliefe that everybody is made from earth and that the soul does not live inside the body but vice versa.

If someone could please help me translate this that woul be fantastic.

Thanks in advance.


It's a good idea to be very cautious about so-called Celtic beliefs that you read about online or in new wave books, because most of what has been written is nonsense. For historical reasons, very little is truly known about the religious beliefs of people in pre-Christian Ireland (or Scotland or Wales), and people have been making it up for over 1,500 years. Recent scholarship shows that even the monks who wrote down many myths and legends in the early Christian period and then in the Middle Ages altered them for religious reasons, or made some of them up out of whole cloth.

As to the translation you asked for, here's a start, but be sure to wait for comments by others, because things can be said various ways, there are multiple choices for some terms, and someone else may be able to do something more poetic:

Ón dorchadas an domhain a bheirtear muid
From the darkness of the earth we are born

'S go dtí dorchadas an domhain a fillfimid
And to the darkness of the earth we will return

Sé turas a rachaidh gach aon duine air
It's a journey everyone will take

Sé turas atá eagla ar gach aon duine roimh
It's a journey everyone fears.

Sé turas is éigean do gach aon duine á dhéanamh
It's a journey everyone has to take.

Agus nuair atá sé críochnaithe
And once it's over

fágfaidh ár gcoirp ár n-anamacha
our bodies will leave our souls

agus éireoidh siad i dtalamh arís
and they will become earth again

chun a bheith bonn an túis núa
to be the basis for a new beginning
[I don't know of a word to use for template in this sense]


Absolutely concur with Caoimhín re "Celtic beliefs." The Celts weren't even a single, united people.

Caoimhín, I think I'd change "ár n-anamacha" to "ár n-anam" (singular usually used when speaking of something that everyone has one of)

Redwolf


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PostPosted: Sat 08 Jul 2017 7:38 pm 
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I'm going to third the whole "Celtic Beliefs" thing.

Also, as to Caoimhín's solution, a few things:

Ón dorchadas an domhain > Ó dhorchadas an domhain (Can't have repeating article in genitive)

For the next part, a few changes:

I also would prefer changing "It's a journey" to be definite as well.

I'd also prefer to switch gach aon to chuile or achan to condense the structure a bit, but that's fairly dialectal, so I went with cách instead (which might be dialectal)

Is é an turas a rachaidh cách air (Is é > Sé; Is é an > Sé'n if you want to condense it)

Sé'n turas a bhfuil eagla ar chách roimhe (Indirect relative clause)

Sé'n turas ar éigean do chách a dhul air (I just prefer the indirect relative clause to Caoimhín's structure, dunno why; also, I think his would need to be a dhéanamh instead of á dhéanamh)

Agus nuair a bheas/bheidh sé críochnaithe (Future tense here to go with the next part; could also say "Nuair a chríochnós/chríochnóidh sé for 'when it finishes')

Fágfaidh ar gcoirp ár n-anam (following Redwolf's suggestion and leaving out my propensity for cuid before all plurals)

agus beidh siad ina gcré arís (cré is what's used for 'dust to dust')

mar bhonn an túis nua (I just prefer using 'mar'; 'they will become dust again as the base of a new start')

Please correct anything y'all see wrong or don't like there.


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PostPosted: Sat 08 Jul 2017 8:01 pm 
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CaoimhínSF wrote:
Ón dorchadas an domhain a bheirtear muid
From the darkness of the earth we are born


Ó dhorchadas an domhain (as Galaxy already mentioned)
Or better here:
Do dhorchadas an domhain ... (compare: Rugadh é di.)

CaoimhínSF wrote:
Sé turas a rachaidh gach aon duine air
It's a journey everyone will take


Is turas é a rachaidh gach aon duine air.
or
'S turas é a rachaidh gach aon duine air.

("Is é turas ..." isn't "It's a journey", wrong word order)

or definite the journey:
Is é an turas é a rachaidh gach aon duine air. = it's the journey ...
or
'Sé'n turas é a rachaidh gach aon duine air.

The same in the next phrases.


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PostPosted: Sat 08 Jul 2017 8:18 pm 
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galaxyrocker wrote:
Sé'n turas ar éigean do chách a dhul air (I just prefer the indirect relative clause to Caoimhín's structure, dunno why;


Yes, the relative clause must be indirect because of the pronoun "air" referring back to "an turas".


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PostPosted: Mon 10 Jul 2017 11:00 am 
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Joined: Mon 26 Jun 2017 10:02 am
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Thank you all for your help with translating.
It would have tanken me ages to get to this point myself.


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PostPosted: Mon 10 Jul 2017 5:32 pm 
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Posts: 715
Quote:
'S go dtí dorchadas an domhain a fillfimid
And to the darkness of the earth we will return


'ar' is the preposition that's typically used with 'fill' (though I'm not saying 'go/go dtí' are wrong).

Genesis 3:19 - '...until thou return to the ground...and unto dust shalt thou return'.
...go bhfillfidh tú ar an talamh...agus ar an luaithreach is ea a fillfidh tú

Quote:
Ó dorchadas an domhain(as Galaxy already mentioned)
Or better here:
Do dhorchadas an domhain...
(Compare: Rugadh é di.)


But 'rugadh leanbh di' = literally, 'a child was born to her'. The preposition 'do' isn't actually suitable for the requested translation.

Some minor points:
-If 'souls' is to be made singular, the same applies to 'bodies'.
-I don't see how 'the journey' is an improvement on 'a journey'.
-It's 'a new beginning', not 'the new beginning'.


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PostPosted: Fri 21 Jul 2017 5:26 pm 
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Errigal wrote:
Some minor points:

Errigal enough with the minor points -- let's see your translation! I always love your translations of poetry and songs!!

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