mimerim wrote:
Not to beat this to death, but I just want to make sure I'm getting this. If someone asks you something in the conditional, to be polite, you remove the conditional.
But if manners aren't necessary, you keep the conditional.
And in koko's example, what if you were answering the question ("Would you give her the money if she asked you for it?") in the affirmative? Would you say
I would give her the money. ??
But even then there's still some question, right? So if you were 100% sure you'd give the money and had it in your hand to give her, would you then say,
I will give her the money. ??
I think you’ve misunderstood a bit.
In Irish (as in English), the conditional is often used to be polite. So instead of asking “Can you close the door?” (which is straightforward and to the point, but comes off as being rash), you use the conditional to take the edge of: “Could you close the door?”.
That’s one use of the conditional. There isn’t really any condition there at all, it just marks that you’re being polite and not wishing to sound rough.
A completely separate use of the conditional is as an actual conditional, where it marks that an action
would take place if the condition were met—but not if the condition weren’t met. Compare the difference between these two phrases:
(A) “Would give me the money, please?”
(B) “Would you give me the money if I were ill and needed it for surgery?”
In the former type (A), you’re not asking whether the person would, hypothetically, if something else were to happen, give you the money—you’re just asking for the money in a polite way. Not so in the latter (B), where you’re talking about a hypothetical situation that depends on a condition.
Now, in Irish, when you reply to a question of the former type (A), you reply in the future, rather than the conditional. You have no reason to be polite when you’re just stating what you will or will not do. Similarly, if you repeat the verb in English, you’ll use the present tense (working as a future tense here, since English doesn’t have a real, grammatical future tense).
But in type (B), you can’t just get rid of the conditional, because it’s actually conditional in meaning. If someone asks you whether, in a certain situation, you would do something or not, you can’t just reply with a statement of what you will (in the future) do. That doesn’t make sense. Compare:
(A)
— “
Would you give me the money, please?” (polite conditional)
— “I certainly
will not, you eejit!” (present)
(B)
— “
Would you give me the money if I were ill and needed it for surgery?” (real conditional)
— “I certainly
would not, you eejit!” (real conditional)
It’s exactly the same in Irish:
(A)
— “An dtabharfá an t-airgead dom, le do thoil?” (polite conditional)
— “Ní thabharfaidh ar chor ar bith, a amadáin! (future)
(B)
— “An dtabharfá an t-airgead dom dá mbeinn tinn agus é de dhíth orm fá choinne obráide?” (real conditional)
— “Ní thabharfainn ar chor ar bith, a amadáin! (real conditional)