Thirty years is a long time to be saying something that doesn't exist......

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Not word-initially before an r. Slender dhr- and ghr-, as well as dhl-/ghl-/(dhn-/)ghn- are often pronounced with a broad(ish) dh/gh, though the second consonant usually remains slender. It’s very hard to begin a word with [jɾ/jl/jn], so it’s avoided.

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Not a native speaker.

Always wait for at least three people to agree on a translation, especially if it’s for something permanent.

My translations are usually GU (Ulster Irish), unless CO (Standard Orthography) is requested.

Interesting to find that it does exist. I looked it up, but it would appear that saying "often" here is somewhat inaccurate.

Most native speakers in Connemara have no problem saying [jɾ/jl/jn], although some do substitute a broad dh or gh to give /ɣr´/, etc., with the second consonant remaining slender, as you mentioned.

Dropping the /ɣr´/ to /gr´/ only occurs rarely among Connemara Gaeltacht speakers (4 out of about 340 surveyed) and those were very young people whose Irish was also in other ways influenced by school Irish and one returnee from the States. The substitution to g appears to be more of a school Irish phenomenon than a native one, at least in Connemara.

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Múinteoir Gaeilge - Irish Teacher
My "specialty" is Connemara Irish, particularly Cois Fhairrge dialect, but I can also speak Ulster and Munster Irish with native-level pronunciation.
Is fearr Gaeilge ḃriste ná Béarla cliste, cinnte, aċ i ḃfad níos fearr aríst í Gaeilge ḃinn ḃeo na nGaeltaċtaí.
Gaeilge Chonnacht (GC), go háraid Gaeilge Chois Fhairrge (GCF), Gaeilic Uladh (GU), Gaelainn na Mumhan (GM), agus Gaeilge an Chaighdeáin Oifigiúil (CO).

I think in Donegal/Ulster, the substitution is nearly ubiquitous—‘often’ was not really meant as a proper statistic, just a vague observation.


Oh, I hadn’t even notice that Saoirse had written hers as without lenition. I was only talking about substituting the broad /ɣ/ for the slender one.

Incidentally, what’s the survery you’re quoting here? What was tested?

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Not a native speaker.

Always wait for at least three people to agree on a translation, especially if it’s for something permanent.

My translations are usually GU (Ulster Irish), unless CO (Standard Orthography) is requested.

That fits with what I've heard from Donegal songs, etc. I'm not exactly sure of the statistic for Connemara either, only that the /ɣ´r´/ form appears to be treated as the usual case, and /ɣr´/ as a special case in the survey (unless I misread it).


Yes, I thought that point needed clarification.


The Irish of Iorras Aithneach County Galway, Brian Ó Curnáin, Dublin Institute for Advanced Studies 2007. It is actually more specific to West Connemara than Connemara as a whole, of course.

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Múinteoir Gaeilge - Irish Teacher
My "specialty" is Connemara Irish, particularly Cois Fhairrge dialect, but I can also speak Ulster and Munster Irish with native-level pronunciation.
Is fearr Gaeilge ḃriste ná Béarla cliste, cinnte, aċ i ḃfad níos fearr aríst í Gaeilge ḃinn ḃeo na nGaeltaċtaí.
Gaeilge Chonnacht (GC), go háraid Gaeilge Chois Fhairrge (GCF), Gaeilic Uladh (GU), Gaelainn na Mumhan (GM), agus Gaeilge an Chaighdeáin Oifigiúil (CO).