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PostPosted: Sat 10 Aug 2019 1:37 am 
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I want to get a tattoo with the phrase "drink the poison yourself," originally "Ipse venena bibas" in Latin as seen on the Catholic St. Benedict medal, but in Irish instead of Latin, as I'm very proud of my Irish heritage. I would prefer Munster Irish because that's where most of my family is from.


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PostPosted: Sat 10 Aug 2019 7:48 pm 
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dmag25 wrote:
I want to get a tattoo with the phrase "drink the poison yourself," originally "Ipse venena bibas" in Latin as seen on the Catholic St. Benedict medal, but in Irish instead of Latin, as I'm very proud of my Irish heritage. I would prefer Munster Irish because that's where most of my family is from.

Ól an nimh tú féin!

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I'm not a native (or entirely fluent) speaker, so be sure to wait for confirmations/corrections, especially for tattoos.


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PostPosted: Sat 10 Aug 2019 9:01 pm 
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CaoimhínSF wrote:
dmag25 wrote:
I want to get a tattoo with the phrase "drink the poison yourself," originally "Ipse venena bibas" in Latin as seen on the Catholic St. Benedict medal, but in Irish instead of Latin, as I'm very proud of my Irish heritage. I would prefer Munster Irish because that's where most of my family is from.

Ól an nimh tú féin!


:??: That is a literal translation of English Drink the poison yourself.
But it doesn't work in Irish.
There's an extra reflexive pronoun in English (myself, yourself, ...), put somewhere in the sentence.
But in Irish, féin is next to the subject pronoun. (D'ól mé féin an nimh. = I drank the poison myself.)
Tú féin is subject, an nimh is object. The subject must come first, next to the verb.
A subject pronoun isn't necessary in 2nd person imperative (except for emphasis), because it is a synthetic verb form, so féin is enough.

Ól féin an nimh! = Drink the poison yourself!

Because Latin bibas is subjunctive, Irish subjunctive might be used as well (instead of imperative above).
Go n-óla tú féin an nimh. (but it is less a command in Irish than in Latin: "May you drink the poison yourself.")


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PostPosted: Sun 11 Aug 2019 10:58 am 
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Labhrás wrote:
Because Latin bibas is subjunctive, Irish subjunctive might be used as well (instead of imperative above).
Go n-óla tú féin an nimh. (but it is less a command in Irish than in Latin: "May you drink the poison yourself.")


I thought the same thing. A curse as it were. :) By the way, would "thú" also be possible here?


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PostPosted: Sun 11 Aug 2019 11:35 am 
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tiomluasocein wrote:
Labhrás wrote:
Because Latin bibas is subjunctive, Irish subjunctive might be used as well (instead of imperative above).
Go n-óla tú féin an nimh. (but it is less a command in Irish than in Latin: "May you drink the poison yourself.")


I thought the same thing. A curse as it were. :) By the way, would "thú" also be possible here?


"go n-óla thú"? No, it wouldn't
A subject "tú" is almost always unlenited: ólann tú, ólfaidh tú, d'ól tú, go n-óla tú.
The only exception is imperative mood with an extra pronoun for emphasis: ól thusa (drink you!)


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PostPosted: Mon 12 Aug 2019 1:43 am 
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Labhrás wrote:
tiomluasocein wrote:
Labhrás wrote:
Because Latin bibas is subjunctive, Irish subjunctive might be used as well (instead of imperative above).
Go n-óla tú féin an nimh. (but it is less a command in Irish than in Latin: "May you drink the poison yourself.")


I thought the same thing. A curse as it were. :) By the way, would "thú" also be possible here?


"go n-óla thú"? No, it wouldn't
A subject "tú" is almost always unlenited: ólann tú, ólfaidh tú, d'ól tú, go n-óla tú.
The only exception is imperative mood with an extra pronoun for emphasis: ól thusa (drink you!)


Oh, that's what I was thinking. Thanks.


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PostPosted: Tue 13 Aug 2019 10:01 pm 
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Joined: Fri 09 Mar 2012 6:16 pm
Posts: 1521
Labhrás wrote:
CaoimhínSF wrote:
dmag25 wrote:
I want to get a tattoo with the phrase "drink the poison yourself," originally "Ipse venena bibas" in Latin as seen on the Catholic St. Benedict medal, but in Irish instead of Latin, as I'm very proud of my Irish heritage. I would prefer Munster Irish because that's where most of my family is from.

Ól an nimh tú féin!


:??: That is a literal translation of English Drink the poison yourself.
But it doesn't work in Irish.
There's an extra reflexive pronoun in English (myself, yourself, ...), put somewhere in the sentence.
But in Irish, féin is next to the subject pronoun. (D'ól mé féin an nimh. = I drank the poison myself.)
Tú féin is subject, an nimh is object. The subject must come first, next to the verb.
A subject pronoun isn't necessary in 2nd person imperative (except for emphasis), because it is a synthetic verb form, so féin is enough.

Ól féin an nimh! = Drink the poison yourself!

Because Latin bibas is subjunctive, Irish subjunctive might be used as well (instead of imperative above).
Go n-óla tú féin an nimh. (but it is less a command in Irish than in Latin: "May you drink the poison yourself.")


:good:

When I saw the request initially

ól an nimh duit féin popped into my head.

Is that possible? :??:

_________________
Is Fearr súil romhainn ná ḋá ṡúil inár ndiaiḋ
(Amhlaoibh Ó Súilleabháin)

Please wait for corrections/ more input from other forum members before acting on advice


I'm familiar with Munster Irish/ Gaolainn na Mumhan (GM) and the Official Standard/an Caighdeán Oifigiúil (CO)


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PostPosted: Sat 31 Aug 2019 1:19 am 
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Exactly the same popped into my head. I supposed it might be argued the meaning is perhaps subtly different? (Drink it for *yourself*). But I think it's viable to be honest.


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