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PostPosted: Wed 27 Feb 2019 5:21 pm 
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Hi. I'm new to this forum. I am American, of Irish heritage through my mother. I am hoping to obtain an accurate translation for an Irish language/Ogham alphabet small personal tattoo.
This is not a whim tattoo. I don't have any tattoos and am 50 years old. This is to commemorate a milestone in my life after over 25-30 years of struggle.
If anyone can assist me, I'd be grateful!! If not, I won't get an incorrect tattoo.
First, I'd like to make sure the Irish language combined with the Ogham alphabet is acceptable. I don't want to muddle or mix up any languages due to my lack of knowledge.
Thank you,
Eliz McD.


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PostPosted: Wed 27 Feb 2019 9:46 pm 
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Location: Corcaigh
Eliz McD. wrote:
Hi. I'm new to this forum. I am American, of Irish heritage through my mother. I am hoping to obtain an accurate translation for an Irish language/Ogham alphabet small personal tattoo.
This is not a whim tattoo. I don't have any tattoos and am 50 years old. This is to commemorate a milestone in my life after over 25-30 years of struggle.
If anyone can assist me, I'd be grateful!! If not, I won't get an incorrect tattoo.
First, I'd like to make sure the Irish language combined with the Ogham alphabet is acceptable. I don't want to muddle or mix up any languages due to my lack of knowledge.
Thank you,
Eliz McD.


There are very few limitations on what you can represent in ogam. There are some letters which occur in english and modern Irish which can't be easily represented using ogam, and there's no consensus how to represent long vowels (á, é, í, ó, and ú) using the ogam alphabet, however, it's perfectly acceptable to use it to represent whatever you would like to, it the same way that you could use the Cyrillic alphabet to represent words in languages which wouldn't normally use it, like English.

If you tell us what you would like to translate, it will be easier to say if it can easily be represented in ogam.


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PostPosted: Wed 27 Feb 2019 11:29 pm 
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Thank you. Of course. I started with the word 'survivor' finding the word 'mharthanoir'. But found similar & not so similar ones words, also.
So I looked up 'strength' and found 'neart'.
For the word 'courage', I found 'misneach'.
Then, looking at the Ohgam (spelled right?) word for 'strength', I found multiple versions. So I'm not sure if which Ogham translators online are accurate.
'Survivor' is the word that most defines what I'm looking for. 'Strength' would work but isn't quite as accurate.
Thank you, Eliz


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PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019 7:43 am 
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Ogham is an alphabet contrived of lines across a center line. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ogham

Is that what you want? Or do you want "Insular Script"? See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insular_script

Look at this page https://www.focloir.ie/en/dictionary/ei/survivor and read the examples and let us know the closest meaning you want. Then we can work on either an Ogham or Insular Script transcription.


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PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019 12:38 pm 
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Ogham is definitely what I want.
When I went to the www.focloir link, I couldn't get a translation, but I've checked that site before and have gotten one. If I remember correctly, that site gave me 'marthanoir', as opposed to 'mharthanoir'.
I previously checked other various translation sites and received 'mharthanoir' multiple times.
The word 'teacht' came up once in a translation of a couple of sentences containing 'survivor', but this seemed to be different, possibly, in the way it was used in the sentence.
Thank you for your help!!!
Elizabeth


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PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019 9:55 pm 
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Location: Corcaigh
Eliz McD. wrote:
Ogham is definitely what I want.
When I went to the http://www.focloir link, I couldn't get a translation, but I've checked that site before and have gotten one. If I remember correctly, that site gave me 'marthanoir', as opposed to 'mharthanoir'.
I previously checked other various translation sites and received 'mharthanoir' multiple times.
The word 'teacht' came up once in a translation of a couple of sentences containing 'survivor', but this seemed to be different, possibly, in the way it was used in the sentence.
Thank you for your help!!!
Elizabeth


I think what tiomluasocein was getting at is that there are a multitude of ways to translate a word. Just because survivor has the connotations you like in english, doesn't mean that the word marthanóir has the same connotations in Irish. What you'll see at the link to focloir.ie are four possible ways the term survivor could be translaterd:

1. A survivor of a disaster or an illness.
2. A survivor of a traumatic event.
3. A person who is resillient.
4. Something which remains (like trees in a forrest, or someone who didn't lose their job when lots of others were being laid off).

Each of these is a different context in Irish and should be translated differently. So, it depends on what you intend to convey by "survivor". What is the context?

As regards your spelling of marthanóir, there are two things to note. You do not need the h after the letter m (mharthanóir) if you are just using the word on its own. It is a grammatical feature of the language which may be caused by a preceding word. You do, however, need to use the letter ó, with the accent mark over it. Without it the word is misspelled.

The choice you will have to make if you want this word (or any word with such an accent mark) is whether or not to use ogam, as accent marks cannot be represented in ogam, but without the accent mark, the word is incorrectly spelled.

In any case, the word may not be the best translation for you. That depends, as I said, on the context of the term, survivor, and what it means to you. If you can let us know that we can offer the most appropriate translation.


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PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019 10:19 pm 
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I would need the word meaning a survivor of a traumatic event. Resilient would be a second option, but not quite as accurate.
I had a feeling that the way the word was used would change the translation. Thank you for explaining that.


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PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019 10:47 pm 
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Eliz McD. wrote:
I would need the word meaning a survivor of a traumatic event. Resilient would be a second option, but not quite as accurate.
I had a feeling that the way the word was used would change the translation. Thank you for explaining that.


In that case, maybe fulaingt. It means something like endurance, or the act of bearing or suffering through something.

Wait to hear from others for more suggestions.


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PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019 11:12 pm 
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"marthanóir" seems to be a legal or biological term; for example, after a husband dies, the wife is the survivor.

Look here at the word "fuíll", definition #6, old spelling "fuigheall": https://www.teanglann.ie/en/fgb/fu%C3%ADoll

Like the survivor of a battle which would be "fuíolláir", "fuighealláir(?). Is that close to what you want?

Or this? https://www.teanglann.ie/en/fgb/éalaitheach definition#2? Variant "éalaitheoir".

A lone survivor? https://www.teanglann.ie/en/fgb/stadhnóir

Or https://www.teanglann.ie/en/fgb/iarmhar

By the way, this is an example of Ogham. Just to be sure, this is what you want, right? https://i.pinimg.com/736x/3e/cd/7f/3ecd ... ea8a9a.jpg


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PostPosted: Fri 01 Mar 2019 8:28 pm 
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Hi. I looked up fulaingt. I saw it meaning endurance and suffering, which could work.
I looked up some of the other words and the translations were not related to my topic. Fuill was translated as tricks and fuiollair was breeder. Possibly the accent marks are throwing off the tranlation.
The only other one that came somewhat close was stadhnoir, lone survivor. There may be no completely accurate translation.
Does 'neart' mean strength? I also saw a picture on the Internet that had 'bri' (accent oved the i) meaning strength. Could this be the tree symbolism associated with Ogham?

Thanks to those who helped me so far!!
I hope to continue getting suggestions to check out.
Elizabeth


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