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 Post subject: Names
PostPosted: Tue 31 Jul 2018 3:10 pm 
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Joined: Tue 31 Jul 2018 2:56 pm
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Hi all,

I have a couple of questions on two names.

Eibhlín - I have heard this name pronounced different ways. Evleen (This is how I would assume it should be pronounced), Eileen (I understand this is because the bh here is silent) and finally Ev a leen (I don't really understand where the a comes from). I just wanted to know are all three acceptable pronunciations?

Art - Just wanted to check does a name like this starting with a vowel change in the vocative case? My understanding would have been no change if the name begins with a vowel or N/L/R. I have though seen it written as a Airt would this be correct and would it apply to other names beginning with a vowel or N/L/R?


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 Post subject: Re: Names
PostPosted: Tue 31 Jul 2018 3:47 pm 
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Aodh wrote:
Hi all,

I have a couple of questions on two names.

Eibhlín - I have heard this name pronounced different ways. Evleen (This is how I would assume it should be pronounced), Eileen (I understand this is because the bh here is silent) and finally Ev a leen (I don't really understand where the a comes from). I just wanted to know are all three acceptable pronunciations?

There's often a "helping vowel" in Irish.
Usually it is used between l, n, r as first consonant and b, bh, g, m, mh as second (e.g. seilbh /s´el´əv´/, dorcha /dorəxə/)
But in Munster it is used with l, n, r as second consonant as well, and even a following long vowel doesn't hinder its occurance, so Eibhlín as if written "Eibheilín" (as long as bh isn't made silent)

Aodh wrote:
Art - Just wanted to check does a name like this starting with a vowel change in the vocative case? My understanding would have been no change if the name begins with a vowel or N/L/R. I have though seen it written as a Airt would this be correct and would it apply to other names beginning with a vowel or N/L/R?

Art, a Airt

Words with vowel or l, n, r doesn't change in the beginning (i.e. not "a hAirt" or similar nonsense)
Other consonants are lenited following the vocative particle a: a Sheáin, a Phóil, a Thomáis, a Dhiarmaid, a Mháire, etc.

But they change in the end if they do so (slenderizing their last consonant) in genitive, too,
That's called "1st declension":

Seán, genitive Seáin, so vocative Seáin as well (a Sheáin with the unavoidable particle)
Art, genitive Airt, so vocative Airt as well (a Airt)
Diarmaid, genitive Diarmada (3rd declension), so vocative a Dhiarmaid
Female names never belong to 1st declension, so no change in vocative (except for lenition if appropriate)
so Sinéad, a Shinéad

By the way. The particle "a" in "a Airt" is silent but nonetheless written.


Last edited by Labhrás on Tue 31 Jul 2018 4:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Names
PostPosted: Tue 31 Jul 2018 3:54 pm 
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Joined: Tue 31 Jul 2018 2:56 pm
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Go raibh maith agat a Labhráis tuigim sin anois.

Regards Eibhlín would the pronunciation Ev leen be incorrect then?


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 Post subject: Re: Names
PostPosted: Wed 01 Aug 2018 12:52 am 
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Aodh wrote:
Eibhlín - I have heard this name pronounced different ways. Evleen (This is how I would assume it should be pronounced), Eileen (I understand this is because the bh here is silent) and finally Ev a leen (I don't really understand where the a comes from). I just wanted to know are all three acceptable pronunciations?
Labhrás given a fine answer above. Here is my two bobs worth.

Eibhlín is one of those names like Siobhán that is pronounced differently from family to family and varies even within the same dialect. The pronunciations I have encountered are:

Connacht:
EV-leen /'ew´l´i:n´/
EV-a-leen /'ew´əl´i:n´/
EYE-leen /'ail´i:n´/ as if spelled "Eidhlín"

Munster:
ev-a-LEEN /ew´ə'l´i:n´/
ay-LEEN /ei'l´i:n´/ (Dillon/Ó Cróinín)

With names "correct" is whatever way the parents intended the name to be pronounced (provided that the parents are native speakers, of course).

_________________

WARNING: Intermediate speaker - await further opinions, corrections and adjustments before acting on my advice.
My "specialty" is Connemara Irish, particularly Cois Fhairrge dialect.
Is fearr Gaeilge ḃriste ná Béarla cliste, cinnte, aċ i ḃfad níos fearr aríst í Gaeilge ḃinn ḃeo na nGaeltaċtaí.
Gaeilge Chonnacht (GC), go háraid Gaeilge Chois Fhairrge (GCF), agus Gaeilge an Chaighdeáin Oifigiúil (CO).


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 Post subject: Re: Names
PostPosted: Wed 01 Aug 2018 8:00 am 
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Joined: Tue 31 Jul 2018 2:56 pm
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Go raibh maith agat.


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