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 Post subject: Verb focus
PostPosted: Mon 27 Apr 2015 9:05 am 
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Dia daoibh aríst a chairde. Táim ag déanamh piosa beag faoin "verb focus" san abairt. Táim ag usáid "Intermediate Irish" le Stenson mar is gnáth. She give a few examples on how to shift emphasis to the verb as she states a verb with personal endings etc are the only elements which can't be place at the start of a verb to highlight it. She gives the following ways;

1: verbal nouns in progressive structures eg: (Is) ag caint le mo mhuintir a bhí mé. It’s talking to my family I was.

2: An inverted verbal noun structure can also be fronted for emphasis eg: An fhuinneog a bhriseadh a rinne sé. He broke the window.

3:An alternative structure reverses the order of elements completely, putting the focus of attention at the end of the sentence, preceded by the background information in a relative clause introduced by ’séard. eg: ’Séard a chonaic tú ná deilf.
What you saw was a dolphin.

4:A verb may also be emphasized using a relative clause after is amhlaidh eg: Is amhlaidh a bhris sé an fhuinneog. The fact is, he broke the window.

I know it could be a dialect thing (she does say that number 4 is quite common in Munster) but are any of th above more common than the rest? Even taking dialects out of the equation, would one of the above be more common than the rest in say the CO?

'maith agaibh


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 Post subject: Re: Verb focus
PostPosted: Mon 27 Apr 2015 9:55 am 
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Cliathach wrote:
Dia daoibh aríst a chairde. Táim ag déanamh piosa beag faoin "verb focus" san abairt. Táim ag usáid "Intermediate Irish" le Stenson mar is gnáth. She give a few examples on how to shift emphasis to the verb as she states a verb with personal endings etc are the only elements which can't be place at the start of a verb to highlight it. She gives the following ways;

1: verbal nouns in progressive structures eg: (Is) ag caint le mo mhuintir a bhí mé. It’s talking to my family I was.

2: An inverted verbal noun structure can also be fronted for emphasis eg: An fhuinneog a bhriseadh a rinne sé. He broke the window.

3:An alternative structure reverses the order of elements completely, putting the focus of attention at the end of the sentence, preceded by the background information in a relative clause introduced by ’séard. eg: ’Séard a chonaic tú ná deilf.
What you saw was a dolphin.

4:A verb may also be emphasized using a relative clause after is amhlaidh eg: Is amhlaidh a bhris sé an fhuinneog. The fact is, he broke the window.

I know it could be a dialect thing (she does say that number 4 is quite common in Munster) but are any of th above more common than the rest? Even taking dialects out of the equation, would one of the above be more common than the rest in say the CO?

'maith agaibh


1) and 2) are used in all dialects.

In 3) emphasis is put on deilf (or anything else coming after ), not on the verb.
So, to emphasize the verb a verbal noun structure must follow .
Stenson gives this example:
Séard a rinne siad ná an fhuinneog a bhriseadh.
But this sentence appears to me to be a mix of dialects.
Except for Déise Irish the contraction séard is not used in Munster but "is é rud"
Is é rud a rinne siad ná an fhuinneog a bhriseadh.
This "suspensive ná" is used only in Munster. In Connacht and Ulster only a pause is made in speech (I made a colon to symbolize it).
So in Connacht this sentence is:
Séard a rinne siad: an fhuinneo(i)g a bhriseadh.
In Ulster I'd guess:
Siod a ...

On the other side, GGBC gives "is é rud" as an alternative for is amhlaidh to emphasize the verb (of course without or a pause):
is amhlaidh a thit sé de chrann; is é rud a thit sé de chrann. (usually is é rud > séard)

4) In Connacht the usual construction is "is é an chaoi" instead of "is amhlaidh":
Is é an chaoi ar bhris sé an fhuinneo(i)g.

Other alternatives for "is amhlaidh" are "is ann", "is ea" "is é".
Ó Sé gives these examples in Gaeilge Chorca Dhuibhne:
Is ea a stracfaidh tú an fód
Is ann a cuirtí daoine lé scéala
Is é a bhuailidís thuas é ar bharra na slipe


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 Post subject: Re: Verb focus
PostPosted: Wed 29 Apr 2015 9:50 am 
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Joined: Sun 11 Sep 2011 12:57 pm
Posts: 270
Location: An Chathair Bhreá
Labhrás wrote:
Cliathach wrote:
Dia daoibh aríst a chairde. Táim ag déanamh piosa beag faoin "verb focus" san abairt. Táim ag usáid "Intermediate Irish" le Stenson mar is gnáth. She give a few examples on how to shift emphasis to the verb as she states a verb with personal endings etc are the only elements which can't be place at the start of a verb to highlight it. She gives the following ways;

1: verbal nouns in progressive structures eg: (Is) ag caint le mo mhuintir a bhí mé. It’s talking to my family I was.

2: An inverted verbal noun structure can also be fronted for emphasis eg: An fhuinneog a bhriseadh a rinne sé. He broke the window.

3:An alternative structure reverses the order of elements completely, putting the focus of attention at the end of the sentence, preceded by the background information in a relative clause introduced by ’séard. eg: ’Séard a chonaic tú ná deilf.
What you saw was a dolphin.

4:A verb may also be emphasized using a relative clause after is amhlaidh eg: Is amhlaidh a bhris sé an fhuinneog. The fact is, he broke the window.

I know it could be a dialect thing (she does say that number 4 is quite common in Munster) but are any of th above more common than the rest? Even taking dialects out of the equation, would one of the above be more common than the rest in say the CO?

'maith agaibh


1) and 2) are used in all dialects.

In 3) emphasis is put on deilf (or anything else coming after ), not on the verb.
So, to emphasize the verb a verbal noun structure must follow .
Stenson gives this example:
Séard a rinne siad ná an fhuinneog a bhriseadh.
But this sentence appears to me to be a mix of dialects.
Except for Déise Irish the contraction séard is not used in Munster but "is é rud"
Is é rud a rinne siad ná an fhuinneog a bhriseadh.
This "suspensive ná" is used only in Munster. In Connacht and Ulster only a pause is made in speech (I made a colon to symbolize it).
So in Connacht this sentence is:
Séard a rinne siad: an fhuinneo(i)g a bhriseadh.
In Ulster I'd guess:
Siod a ...

On the other side, GGBC gives "is é rud" as an alternative for is amhlaidh to emphasize the verb (of course without or a pause):
is amhlaidh a thit sé de chrann; is é rud a thit sé de chrann. (usually is é rud > séard)

4) In Connacht the usual construction is "is é an chaoi" instead of "is amhlaidh":
Is é an chaoi ar bhris sé an fhuinneo(i)g.

Other alternatives for "is amhlaidh" are "is ann", "is ea" "is é".
Ó Sé gives these examples in Gaeilge Chorca Dhuibhne:
Is ea a stracfaidh tú an fód
Is ann a cuirtí daoine lé scéala
Is é a bhuailidís thuas é ar bharra na slipe


iontach! 'maith agat a chara


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 Post subject: Re: Verb focus
PostPosted: Wed 06 May 2015 12:58 pm 
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Labhrás wrote:
Except for Déise Irish the contraction séard is not used in Munster but "is é rud"

Is the A pronounced in "séard"? I suspect there was historically an article in there (ie "The thing he did was...")

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 Post subject: Re: Verb focus
PostPosted: Wed 06 May 2015 2:20 pm 
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Posts: 1527
NiallBeag wrote:
Labhrás wrote:
Except for Déise Irish the contraction séard is not used in Munster but "is é rud"

Is the A pronounced in "séard"? I suspect there was historically an article in there (ie "The thing he did was...")


Ya, good point, it is more than likely Is é an rud.

As regards if the -a- is pronounced, I don't think so.

The same can be seen with 'céard' which is more than likely cé'n rud or cé é an rud

http://www.teanglann.ie/en/fuaim/c%C3%A9ard

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(Amhlaoibh Ó Súilleabháin)

Please wait for corrections/ more input from other forum members before acting on advice


I'm familiar with Munster Irish/ Gaolainn na Mumhan (GM) and the Official Standard/an Caighdeán Oifigiúil (CO)


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 Post subject: Re: Verb focus
PostPosted: Wed 06 May 2015 2:30 pm 
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Joined: Sat 03 May 2014 4:01 pm
Posts: 1970
NiallBeag wrote:
Labhrás wrote:
Except for Déise Irish the contraction séard is not used in Munster but "is é rud"

Is the A pronounced in "séard"? I suspect there was historically an article in there (ie "The thing he did was...")


no /a/ pronounced /s´e:rd/
letter "a" because of broad -rd

Yes, is é rud a ... = is é an rud a ...
I don't know about the older language but in Modern Irish the article can be omitted here and is frequently so (e.g. is é duine a ...)


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