“For those who have naught, My shield shall stand”

Suggestions on how to translate that please.


What about this -
Cosnóidh mo sciath na daibhir.

Feel free to offer something totally different.

(for Peter)


EDITED

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It is recommended that you always wait for three to agree on a translation.
I speak Connemara Irish, and my input will often reflect that.
I will do an mp3 file on request for short translations.
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I like that as an idiomatic translation, although, I think it is: Cosnóidh in the Caighdeán.

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Please wait for corrections/ more input from other forum members before acting on advice

I had a feeling there was something wrong with the spelling.

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It is recommended that you always wait for three to agree on a translation.
I speak Connemara Irish, and my input will often reflect that.
I will do an mp3 file on request for short translations.
___________________________________________________________

First, a huge thank you to Bríd Mhór for posting this for me.

Second, Hi, all.

As for the translation, I am writing a novel, and am looking for the 14th century Celtic phrase that would be the basis of "For those..." in 15th century Britan. A more modern translation would be "For those who cannot defend themselves, I will." or "For those who are: too weak; are out numbered; really poor fighters; or any other reason they need a little help, I will help".

Do keep in mind that his is a fiction story, so absolute accuracy is not required. All I need is to be close enough to where anyone reading the phrase is going to accept the translation.

Thanks in advance to any and all who help.

You might be able to get away with:

Ar a son siúd "For their sake"

or

Ar son na ndaoine siúd "For the sake of those people"

Generally you run into a problem with these truncated sentences in that the preposition "for" is requires the genitive case, i.e., "for the sake of sth/s.o." and you can't leave a dangling preposition.

The full sentence would be Ar son na ndaoine siúd atá ró-lag, etc.

Await further input ...

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Múinteoir Gaeilge - Irish Teacher
My "specialty" is Connemara Irish, particularly Cois Fhairrge dialect, but I can also speak Ulster and Munster Irish with native-level pronunciation.
Is fearr Gaeilge ḃriste ná Béarla cliste, cinnte, aċ i ḃfad níos fearr aríst í Gaeilge ḃinn ḃeo na nGaeltaċtaí.
Gaeilge Chonnacht (GC), go háraid Gaeilge Chois Fhairrge (GCF), Gaeilic Uladh (GU), Gaelainn na Mumhan (GM), agus Gaeilge an Chaighdeáin Oifigiúil (CO).

Hi Tarn fáilte 'dtín forum, Hi Tarn welcome to the forum!

When you say Britain where exactly do you mean? I'm asking this because in your request you mention a 14th or 15th century Celtic phrase. Irish Gaelic is only one of 5 Celtic languages spoken in what was then considered Britain, Ireland wasn't really under English control at this time except for the Pale or modern day Dublin.

The other Q-Celtic languages spoken in Britain at that time included Scot's Gaelic and Manx (very similar to Irish at this time but they were much more influenced by the Viking invaders). The other P-Celtic languages spoken were Cornish and Welsh and then you have English, French and possibly the emergence of Scots (a dialect of English). So its important to ask yourself where in Britain is the story set, because they mightn't have spoken Irish or its derivatives (Scot's gaelic or Manx) in that region at all.

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Please wait for corrections/ more input from other forum members before acting on advice

This is a fictional story. So the character is in whatever area the reader wishes to imagine. In the story, it takes place a day and half journey south of Medowbrook, an fictitious realm where dragons once roamed and chivalry still lives. The character is Irish by blood, but Born a commoner in a medieval land.

I am writing it so that it can be almost any time, any place. This way, the reader can develop their own image of where and when this place is.

While I know next to nothing about Gaelic, or any of the dialects of Gaelic, I do know that a literal translation is next to impossible. Combine that with the fact that the reader is going to make a second translation into their own dialect as they read it. The reader may read "For those who have naught..." and interpret it as "For those who have nothing..."

Additionally, anyone who is capable of reading Gaelic will, most likely, be learned in modern Gaelic, instead of what was spoken 300 or 400 years ago. Making historical accuracy a bit of overkill.

The most important thing to the story is plausibility. Could "For those who..." have come from the Gaelic phrase that I write in the story.

To tell you exactly where it takes place is impossible because there is no intended place, other than it is in a make believe land. If I write it correctly, the location will be in the mind, and heart of the reader.

I hope that explained, more than confused you.

With that explanation, which would lend itself better to the story; Cosaineoidh or Cosnóidh? The online translator that I'm using will not translate Cosaineoidh.

As it stands now, "Cosnóidh mo sciath na daibhir" translates to "My shield will protect the poor", if I have translated it correctly.

Is there a way to make that closer to meaning "protect those who cannot protect themselves" or "protect the defenseless"? As it stands now, it is quite usable. In fact it lends itself to the normal tenancy to embellish or "improve" on a statement during translation. I was just wondering if there was a phrase that meant defenseless rather than poor.

Thanks.

Cosnóidh mo sciath na daoine gan chosaint.

or maybe

An t-é atá gan chosaint, cosnóidh mo sciath é.

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The dialect I use is Cork Irish.
Ar sgáth a chéile a mhairid na daoine, lag agus láidir, uasal is íseal

Cionnfhaolach corrected that so use "cosnóidh".


For defenseless I'd go with what An Lon Dubh has here.

Or a variation -
Cosnóidh mo sciath iad siúd gan chosaint.


You are very welcome. See what I mean about more than one way to say something.

And like Cionnfhaolach said location is very important. If you are situating your story in Ireland don't call us British.
If the story is in Britain as it is today (there wasn't really a United Britain back then anyhow) then you might need Scots Gaelic, Welsh, or Cornish.

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It is recommended that you always wait for three to agree on a translation.
I speak Connemara Irish, and my input will often reflect that.
I will do an mp3 file on request for short translations.
___________________________________________________________