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PostPosted: Thu 31 May 2018 11:57 pm 
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Dia dhuit!

I want to learn Gaeilge, speak it, read it, write it.
I have read a lot of good comments about gaeilge gan stró (or its online equivalent Ranganna)
However, after trying the first lesson for free, I was disappointed.
They just make you repeat sentences without dissecting them no explaining why they're pronounced like that.
I feel like a parrot just repeating stuff.
How can that be the most popular learning support? Help :winkgrin:


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PostPosted: Fri 01 Jun 2018 5:49 am 
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Location: Santa Cruz Mountains, California, USA
Sionnach wrote:
Dia dhuit!

I want to learn Gaeilge, speak it, read it, write it.
I have read a lot of good comments about gaeilge gan stró (or its online equivalent Ranganna)
However, after trying the first lesson for free, I was disappointed.
They just make you repeat sentences without dissecting them no explaining why they're pronounced like that.
I feel like a parrot just repeating stuff.
How can that be the most popular learning support? Help :winkgrin:


Sionnach, the best way to learn pronunciation is to do it. Memorizing how "these letters make these sounds" will never make you an Irish speaker. They sound the way they sound because that's the sounds those letter combinations make in Irish.

Think about when you were a child learning English...learning to read. Did someone sit you down and explain why things "are pronounced like that"?

If you want to learn to speak, read, and write Irish, start by trusting people who have taught many, many people to speak, read, and write the language. Work your way through the course before you judge it.

I wrote this a while back about learning to make the sounds of Irish. Maybe it will be of some help to you.

https://thegeekygaeilgeoir.wordpress.co ... n-you-say/

Redwolf


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PostPosted: Fri 01 Jun 2018 3:34 pm 
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Redwolf,

Thank you for your comment and your insight!
I realize my original post comes off a bit judgemental indeed... I want to clarify that those were just my feelings at the time and didn't make up any judgement from me as I know that I know nothing.
The link you provided me with is really helpful and I am literally in a moment of "freakoutage".

I will give the method a proper chance!


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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun 2018 3:01 am 
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Location: Santa Cruz Mountains, California, USA
Sionnach wrote:
Redwolf,

Thank you for your comment and your insight!
I realize my original post comes off a bit judgemental indeed... I want to clarify that those were just my feelings at the time and didn't make up any judgement from me as I know that I know nothing.
The link you provided me with is really helpful and I am literally in a moment of "freakoutage".

I will give the method a proper chance!


Freakoutage happens to all of us! Just hang in there...it gets easier!

Redwolf


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PostPosted: Sat 02 Jun 2018 2:33 pm 
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Location: Brussels
Hi Sionnach,

I've looked at a lot of courses and I've found none that give a good explanation of the pronunciation. My advice is to just keep going. Maybe eventually it'll make sense or you'll get an opportunity to get face-to-face help from a native speaker. If you keep going you'll at least learn to understand Irish, and then it's easier to find ways to regularly listen to Irish, and this over time should help then with the pronunciation.

(Just be careful with dialects. You'll never find a coherent set of pronunciation rules if you're taking example from a few natives who follow the Donegal rules plus a few who follow the Cois Fharraige rules, and others who follow the Muskerry rules... You have to pick one dialect (Donegal, Connacht, Munster, or Standard), and know the dialect of everyone you're learning from so that you can ignore the pronunciation of the speakers who are not examples of the dialect you are learning.)

I've learned other languages and actually one of my main rules is to get the pronunciation right from the start, because it's a lot of work to correct it later. But with Irish I've had to give up on that. I don't know if it's because the books are all bad or maybe I have the wrong type of brain for this particular language. So I accept that while I'm learning I'll have to use a pronunciation that I'm dissatisfied with. But the most important thing for any language is: don't give up. And for Irish in particular: don't stop learning just because you're hoping to find a good explanation of the pronunciation.

And when you have questions about specific parts of the pronunciation, post them here. I've gotten good help here.

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PostPosted: Wed 13 Jun 2018 5:57 pm 
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Location: Baile Mhic Ghoilla Eoin, VA
My personal favorite is actually Rosetta Stone (gasp!). It is even more extreme in what you mentioned -- it is entirely focused on repetition and pronunciation and explains literally nothing!

Personally, I did not like Gaeilge gan Stró because it was too basic and because the speakers did not sound like native speakers to me (I haven't listened to it again in years so I cannot vouch whether that is true or not).

Then, of course, the best advice is always this: move to the Gaeltacht and hire several full-time private Irish tutors! hahahahahaha

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PostPosted: Wed 13 Jun 2018 10:20 pm 
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Anyway it's true that it's hard to learn Irish pronunciation apart with native speakers. Because very few non-native speakers do pronounce properly...

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Is fearr Gaeilg na Gaeltaċta ná Gaeilg ar biṫ eile
Agus is í Gaeilg Ġaoṫ Doḃair is binne
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PostPosted: Wed 13 Jun 2018 11:51 pm 
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Cúmhaí wrote:
Then, of course, the best advice is always this: move to the Gaeltacht and hire several full-time private Irish tutors! hahahahahaha
After learning a few languages, my opinion is that the only way an adult can hope to achieve real fluency is by marriage and cohabitation with a native speaker. Unfortunately my wife is refusing to even discuss this option.

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PostPosted: Thu 14 Jun 2018 12:58 pm 
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Maybe it's not necessary to be fluent, but if you want to speak more or less like a native speaker and be able to speak about all sorts of things in a language, indeed you need to be immersed in the language ie. to live among native speakers.

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Is fearr Gaeilg na Gaeltaċta ná Gaeilg ar biṫ eile
Agus is í Gaeilg Ġaoṫ Doḃair is binne
:)


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PostPosted: Thu 14 Jun 2018 5:31 pm 
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Our man in Brussels wrote:
Cúmhaí wrote:
Unfortunately my wife is refusing to even discuss this option.


Well, if she really loves you, she has to make sacrifices so you can achieve your ever sought perfect fluency, right?

Lughaidh wrote:
Maybe it's not necessary to be fluent, but if you want to speak more or less like a native speaker and be able to speak about all sorts of things in a language, indeed you need to be immersed in the language ie. to live among native speakers.


Couldn't agree more. I was pretty smug about my english speaking abilities (which, compared to my fellow french people, was godlike already). Then I came to the US for work and the first english bit I truly mastered was "sorry, what was that? what now? come again?" because I heard it everyday :LOL:


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